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View Full Version : Does "moderate" muslim exist?



stahl
2016-08-07, 07:33 PM
It seems to me like they all just like to pretend to value freedom of speech, human rights etc.

While in reality around their peers they praise sharia law, attend public executions while on vacation in the middle east, want to have their women in niqabs etc.


I see it time and again, smh.

pissfreak
2016-08-07, 07:33 PM
short answer: no

long answer: no

stahl
2016-08-07, 07:37 PM
short answer: no

long answer: no

Pretending to be appalled by terrorism, walking around with those "hug me, i am muslim" cardboards after terror attacks.

But when they are in the comfort of their own homes they get in front of their computers and watch IS propaganda and debate their views on message boards lmao.

pissfreak
2016-08-07, 07:41 PM
Pretending to be appalled by terrorism, walking around with those "hug me, i am muslim" cardboards after terror attacks.

But when they are in the comfort of their own homes they get in front of their computers and watch IS propaganda and debate their views on message boards lmao.

i know exactly what you're talking about. i was surrounded by thousands of muslim refugees last year during the big refugee crisis

honestly i've seen animals that behave better

Safado
2016-08-07, 07:42 PM
"moderate muslim" = oxymoron

FAPump
2016-08-07, 07:44 PM
yes but there all dead

bsp
2016-08-07, 07:51 PM
a moderate muslim is one that wants an extremist muslim to behead you

Omega
2016-08-07, 07:53 PM
Moderate Islam and Radical Islam are buzzwords made up by people who don't understand Islam.

Extremist according to who? Is it extreme to pick up a weapon and fight for something you consider worth fighting for? Is it moderate to let yourselves be walked all over like a pacifist cuck? To allow your religion to be mocked?

ZUZZBRAH
2016-08-07, 08:05 PM
Moderate Islam and Radical Islam are buzzwords made up by people who don't understand Islam.

Extremist according to who? Is it extreme to pick up a weapon and fight for something you consider worth fighting for? Is it moderate to let yourselves be walked all over like a pacifist cuck? To allow your religion to be mocked?

Muslims overwhelming fight each other. The vast majority of terrorist attacks are on other muslims. They put alot more effort into trying to establish sectarian dominance over other muslims than expelling invaders.

Interpolation of political reality is subjective, but your narrative struggles to coherently follow events add they exist.

In my opinion muslims wanna get drunk and bang Nordic women like any man with a pulse on earth does. Some deny it because there manlet muslicels.

Omega
2016-08-07, 08:15 PM
Muslims overwhelming fight each other. The vast majority of terrorist attacks are on other muslims. They put alot more effort into trying to establish sectarian dominance over other muslims than expelling invaders.

Interpolation of political reality is subjective, but your narrative struggles to coherently follow events add they exist.

In my opinion muslims wanna get drunk and bang Nordic women like any man with a pulse on earth does. Some deny it because there manlet muslicels.

None of what you said addressed my post.

ZUZZBRAH
2016-08-07, 08:21 PM
None of what you said addressed my post.:ok:

Omega
2016-08-07, 08:26 PM
:ok:

It didn't lol. I'm asking for a clear definition of extremist vs moderate, because I don't believe that dichotomy exists.

You then go on a tangent about terrorism and muslims killing muslims lol wtf

ZUZZBRAH
2016-08-07, 08:29 PM
It didn't lol. I'm asking for a clear definition of extremist vs moderate, because I don't believe that dichotomy exists.

You then go on a tangent about terrorism and muslims killing muslims lol wtf

If you don't understand my point your either disingenuous or slow. Not going to address someone who is either.

Omega
2016-08-07, 08:36 PM
If you don't understand my point your either disingenuous or slow. Not going to address someone who is either.

Some of what you said was just gibberish, which i find funny you would even suggest calling me slow. "Interpolation of political reality is subjective, but your narrative struggles to coherently follow events add they exist."

I mean wtf does that even mean?

stahl
2016-08-07, 08:45 PM
Omega

A "Moderate" muslim is against terrorism, sharia law, beheadings, isis, corrupt governments, raping, niqabs, domestic violence and so forth.

My hypothesis is that this dont correlate with the fundamentals of islam.

Omega
2016-08-07, 08:50 PM
Omega

A "Moderate" muslim is against terrorism, sharia law, beheadings, isis, corrupt governments, raping, niqabs, domestic violence and so forth.

My hypothesis is that this dont correlate with the fundamentals of islam.

A Muslim against Shar'iah isn't a Muslim by definition.

So this is a good example of how these terms do not represent reality.

aryanbrah
2016-08-08, 02:25 AM
Moderate Islam and Radical Islam are buzzwords made up by people who don't understand Islam.

Extremist according to who? Is it extreme to pick up a weapon and fight for something you consider worth fighting for? Is it moderate to let yourselves be walked all over like a pacifist cuck? To allow your religion to be mocked?

Ok but, if I were gonna go out and blow up a load of people tomorrow, and my friends/family knew, they'd either try to stop me or warn the police - why? So they themselves don't get in shit and their entire community doesn't get branded as harbouring murderers.
However it's hard to compare our two communities, because I don't go to church, so I don't know everyone in my area, whether as muslims around me seem to all know each other, probably went to school together and go to mosque daily, so it's not like it just tarnishes a small selection of people - ie close friends and family. It's everyone, and they don't see the need to police that.
Probably a bit sporadic as I just woke up and my eyes are glued closed, I do however believe that fighting for something you believe in is truly honourable.
With the whole mocking shit, Christianity has been butchered for years by media, press, whatever. I think it's part of being a large movement, you will get mocked - that's life.

Omega
2016-08-08, 03:19 AM
Ok but, if I were gonna go out and blow up a load of people tomorrow, and my friends/family knew, they'd either try to stop me or warn the police - why? So they themselves don't get in shit and their entire community doesn't get branded as harbouring murderers.
However it's hard to compare our two communities, because I don't go to church, so I don't know everyone in my area, whether as muslims around me seem to all know each other, probably went to school together and go to mosque daily, so it's not like it just tarnishes a small selection of people - ie close friends and family. It's everyone, and they don't see the need to police that.
Probably a bit sporadic as I just woke up and my eyes are glued closed, I do however believe that fighting for something you believe in is truly honourable.
With the whole mocking shit, Christianity has been butchered for years by media, press, whatever. I think it's part of being a large movement, you will get mocked - that's life.

I think the notion that all of their close friends and families are aware of their intentions isn't true. That would needlessly put their plan at risk, and it would also put the people they tell at risk.

So then people think Muslims should watch out for people becoming "radicalized", but in the Muslim community, we don't believe in radicalization by and large. When someone is fundamentalist we consider them a strict Muslim. When someone speaks against Israel or NATO involvement in ME affairs, we tend to agree. None of those are things we consider "warning signs".

To put it in perspective I have worked with law enforcement when it came to this issue, and it became abundantly clear they just throw a wide net and try to investigate anyone who fits a very basic profile (one I probably fit) which is -- strict adherence to Islam, generally salafist teachings, anti-war rhetoric.

What I told them is what I tell people here, the final solution to this is a significant shift in foreign policy, but other than that, targeting rational religious people isn't helpful. Most of the domestic terrorism stems from outcasts (possibly mentally disturned), loners, people who feel they don't belong. These people often reject their Muslim communities rather than engage them constructively.

IMO that's your textbook "terrorist" who isn't affiliated directly with an Al Qaeda or an ISIS type group. Like Mateen seems to have been a confirmed homosexual, his possible inner struggle and self hatred led to a "terrorist attack". Of course elements that are directly associated with militant groups, tend to be educated people (e.g., 19 hijackers) who are doing it for what they believe to be morally justified reasons. Are those people "radical"? From an Islamic viewpoint its a grey area. Islam does not condone the mass slaughter of innocent people. However from the perspective of Muslim in the ME who may have witnessed atrocities in Israel or Iraq (1st gulf war), Somalia, Afghanistan, to them if their civilians are fair game, then this falls under "an eye for an eye".

In other words to them its rational behavior and a legitimate method of attacking their enemy rather than a brainwashed "radical" agenda.

We need to steer away from these buzz words and look at it more logically to first understand why its happening and then make informed choices to prevent it.

aryanbrah
2016-08-08, 04:57 AM
I think the notion that all of their close friends and families are aware of their intentions isn't true. That would needlessly put their plan at risk, and it would also put the people they tell at risk.

So then people think Muslims should watch out for people becoming "radicalized", but in the Muslim community, we don't believe in radicalization by and large. When someone is fundamentalist we consider them a strict Muslim. When someone speaks against Israel or NATO involvement in ME affairs, we tend to agree. None of those are things we consider "warning signs".

To put it in perspective I have worked with law enforcement when it came to this issue, and it became abundantly clear they just throw a wide net and try to investigate anyone who fits a very basic profile (one I probably fit) which is -- strict adherence to Islam, generally salafist teachings, anti-war rhetoric.

What I told them is what I tell people here, the final solution to this is a significant shift in foreign policy, but other than that, targeting rational religious people isn't helpful. Most of the domestic terrorism stems from outcasts (possibly mentally disturned), loners, people who feel they don't belong. These people often reject their Muslim communities rather than engage them constructively.

IMO that's your textbook "terrorist" who isn't affiliated directly with an Al Qaeda or an ISIS type group. Like Mateen seems to have been a confirmed homosexual, his possible inner struggle and self hatred led to a "terrorist attack". Of course elements that are directly associated with militant groups, tend to be educated people (e.g., 19 hijackers) who are doing it for what they believe to be morally justified reasons. Are those people "radical"? From an Islamic viewpoint its a grey area. Islam does not condone the mass slaughter of innocent people. However from the perspective of Muslim in the ME who may have witnessed atrocities in Israel or Iraq (1st gulf war), Somalia, Afghanistan, to them if their civilians are fair game, then this falls under "an eye for an eye".

In other words to them its rational behavior and a legitimate method of attacking their enemy rather than a brainwashed "radical" agenda.

We need to steer away from these buzz words and look at it more logically to first understand why its happening and then make informed choices to prevent it.

Wrote some massive fucking spiel but I cba.
We can both agree that Israel, NATO and the involvement of the West in affairs which do not concern them is the root of the problem.
The "refugee" issue in Europe is the fault of the governments funding various organisations to resist and overthrow "dictators", many of which the West probably supported at an earlier date, the constant warfare in the ME for the past 20 or so years is due to Western involvement.

People are always going to be mental, regardless of colour or religion, those people need help from their communities, their national mental health services and I think they need to be withdrawn from the internet, because having EVERYTHING at your fingertips at an instant is only going to infuriate you.
I could google Zionist international organisations and end up in a 2 day fit of rage because the entire world is being controlled by a small number of people, however I don't because being angry about something I cannot change will get me nowhere.
From the Muslim/radical/moderate perspective I have no insight as I have never read any of the teachings of Islam.

Avoneg Nosaj
2016-08-09, 12:22 AM
Moderate Muslim = "Muslim" who doesn't actually follow any Muslim teachings

fatkid
2016-08-09, 12:35 AM
Lol @ being religious in 2016 when the internet and science are a thing.

Omega
2016-08-09, 12:36 AM
Lol @ being religious in 2016 when the internet and science are a thing.

Why don't you just go out and buy a fedora with that moronic logic.

fatkid
2016-08-09, 12:38 AM
Why don't you just go out and buy a fedora with that moronic logic.

At least the fedora would have some weight in the real world and not just a figment of my imagination.

Omega
2016-08-09, 12:39 AM
At least the fedora would have some weight in the real world and not just a figment of my imagination.

Ohhhh look at you being an edgy atheist

:jordan:

fatkid
2016-08-09, 12:41 AM
Ohhhh look at you being an edgy atheist

:jordan:

Not an atheist, they're worse imo. Saying you're not religious but lumping yourself in a religious type structure of disbelief.

I completely understand why religion was necessary in the past ie explaining the stars, controlling the masses, giving people hope. These days, I don't get it.

Omega
2016-08-09, 12:45 AM
Not an atheist, they're worse imo. Saying you're not religious but lumping yourself in a religious type structure of disbelief.

I completely understand why religion was necessary in the past ie explaining the stars, controlling the masses, giving people hope. These days, I don't get it.

Yeah because you're brainwashed by the new-atheist movement spearheaded by a few well known scientists, and an army of edgy atheist retards.

Almost no religious civilization rejected science in the name of religion. You think just because the catholics did it, that represents everyone else? From the ancient egyptians, to the Islamic empire, immense contributions have been made to the field of science.

fatkid
2016-08-09, 12:49 AM
Yeah because you're brainwashed by the new-atheist movement spearheaded by a few well known scientists, and an army of edgy atheist retards.

Almost no religious civilization rejected science in the name of religion. You think just because the catholics did it, that represents everyone else? From the ancient egyptians, to the Islamic empire, immense contributions have been made to the field of science.

I like how defensive you get about someone not believing the same old book you do. I admire your conviction and blind dedication.

Omega
2016-08-09, 12:59 AM
I like how defensive you get about someone not believing the same old book you do. I admire your conviction and blind dedication.

I get defensive? Lol you came in here smugly scoffing at religion like a typical neckbeard, and instead of addressing my response about religion not being antithetical to science... you just call me defensive.

lmao.

fatkid
2016-08-09, 01:09 AM
I get defensive? Lol you came in here smugly scoffing at religion like a typical neckbeard, and instead of addressing my response about religion not being antithetical to science... you just call me defensive.

lmao.

I will always scoff at religion because I think it's stupid and I cannot understand how it is still so prevalent in society today. I am not denying that many religious scholars have made great contributions to science in the past, but I am disputing the need for it in a modern world when all it causes is another excuse to say "oh he's different from me, I don't like him". Religion has done nothing good for quite some time as a whole other than start wars and have innocents killed(I don't just mean Islam). I am completely agnostic to the whole thing because I haven't seen evidence to suggest that any are correct, but I also buy into the hippy ass idea that nature is what is meant by "god" in religious texts and then it would all be a bit more plausible.

It's also 6am and I haven't slept, so I don't know if anything I'm saying is making sense.

pissfreak
2016-08-09, 01:24 AM
I will always scoff at religion because I think it's stupid and I cannot understand how it is still so prevalent in society today. I am not denying that many religious scholars have made great contributions to science in the past, but I am disputing the need for it in a modern world when all it causes is another excuse to say "oh he's different from me, I don't like him". Religion has done nothing good for quite some time as a whole other than start wars and have innocents killed(I don't just mean Islam). I am completely agnostic to the whole thing because I haven't seen evidence to suggest that any are correct, but I also buy into the hippy ass idea that nature is what is meant by "god" in religious texts and then it would all be a bit more plausible.

It's also 6am and I haven't slept, so I don't know if anything I'm saying is making sense.

inb4 omega calls you an ignorant retard just because you have different views on religion

Omega
2016-08-09, 01:26 AM
I will always scoff at religion because I think it's stupid and I cannot understand how it is still so prevalent in society today. I am not denying that many religious scholars have made great contributions to science in the past, but I am disputing the need for it in a modern world when all it causes is another excuse to say "oh he's different from me, I don't like him". Religion has done nothing good for quite some time as a whole other than start wars and have innocents killed(I don't just mean Islam). I am completely agnostic to the whole thing because I haven't seen evidence to suggest that any are correct, but I also buy into the hippy ass idea that nature is what is meant by "god" in religious texts and then it would all be a bit more plausible.

It's also 6am and I haven't slept, so I don't know if anything I'm saying is making sense.

Well number one, religion doesn't attempt to compete with science when it's interpreted correctly. That's why so many religious people contributed greatly to society. So the idea that "it was needed at one point to explain things but now it's not", is erroneous. It's essentially a strawman because religion never claimed to replace rational scientific thought. You can believe that God created everything while also believing in natural laws (because natural law could be a creation of God itself).

To your second point that religion is divisive and causes wars... is this realistic? Did religion cause WWI, or WWII? Did religion cause the cold war? or the Korean war? or the Vietnam war? Did it cause conflicts in the Falklands, is it the cause of the Mexican/South American drug wars which claim tens of thousands of lives every year? Was Joseph Stalin who killed 10m people a religious man? What about Mao? Did Putin invade the Ukraine on religious grounds?

And I can even suggest, that wars in the ME are not religious. Did USA invade Iraq because of religion or because of geopolitics? Did the Arab spring happen because "God told me to fight" or because people felt oppressed by their governments? Even the Israel/Palestine conflict. Are Palestininan attacking Israelis over their religion or because they see them as invaders? Did the Jews decide to take Palestine because of religion or because of perceived persecution by Europeans?

There may be religious overtone to some of these conflicts and wars but to suggest without religion they wouldn't have happened? Bullshit. They are based on money, power, geopolitics... those are secular ideals. blaming religion? How?


inb4 omega calls you an ignorant retard just because you have different views on religion

Age 17

Status: Ignorant

snafu
2016-08-27, 08:53 PM
Well number one, religion doesn't attempt to compete with science when it's interpreted correctly.

https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

Come again?

Omega
2016-08-27, 09:00 PM
https://wikiislam.net/wiki/Scientific_Errors_in_the_Quran

Come again?

:cage2:

HAHAHAHAHAHHAHAAHAH

Purple Pilled
2016-09-27, 02:20 PM
Muslim scholar truly schools the Senator trying to stand up for islam.

Just lol @ him correcting the Liberal Senator so vividly.

@44mins:

wUXhBm-g3YE


Some other videos from muslims (current and past) themselves that will help explain some of their psychology:


wAzBeG7gLnc

bV710c1dgpU

v5foN-2ucZc

Erenbrah
2016-09-29, 08:53 AM
tempted to neg for racism and ignorance.

Archaik85
2016-10-02, 12:05 PM
It seems to me like they all just like to pretend to value freedom of speech, human rights etc.

While in reality around their peers they praise sharia law, attend public executions while on vacation in the middle east, want to have their women in niqabs etc.


I see it time and again, smh.

No, not really. There are "muslims" that are not religous, but they aren't really muslims are they?
Just just look up the various polls that has been made on secular values, human right's, freedom of speech etc, that are targeted to muslims. It's fucking scary reading.

Midnight
2016-10-02, 12:31 PM
Moderates do exist, I've met them, but only the extreme form of Islam is legit. Doesn't take a genius to figure that one out. The moderate form is destined to die out just like modern day Christianity (which is no longer extreme).

sNRuPFQJZxU

VRM
2016-10-02, 03:58 PM
A good friend of mine is a muslim.
I would say he's moderate. He does his thing but doesn't preach about the ills of this and that. Understands that other people with differing opinions exist.
His family are far more conservative than him but even they are very welcoming and always offer food when I'm over in their area.
His auntie and uncle are a lord and lady in the house of lords - even though unofficially they're separated it looks good to keep up pretences. There was a recent situation with his idiot uncle had got himself into and this eastern european whore had managed to wrangle herself into one of his london apartments threatening to tell the press if he tried to kick her out. People think this country is soft - and it is on the government front but when you start fucking with people on a personal level it's just as vindictive as anywhere less developed. Why a close to 70 year old would allow himself to get screwed (literally) by some late 20's girl and think there's anything more at the end of the road than blackmail or problems, is beyond me. This is a smart (supposedly) ex businessman. Just goes to show how stupid you get when you get comfortable.

VRM
2016-10-02, 04:21 PM
Right but 20 year old pussy when you're 70 is worth it

If someone is that desperate for young pussy at that age go see a prostitute anonymously. You would look ridiculous in public and amongst social peers.

IGotNext
2016-10-02, 04:32 PM
Moderate Islam and Radical Islam are buzzwords made up by people who don't understand Islam.

Extremist according to who? Is it extreme to pick up a weapon and fight for something you consider worth fighting for? Is it moderate to let yourselves be walked all over like a pacifist cuck? To allow your religion to be mocked?


True.

If what you know about Islam did not come from reading the Quran and the Haddiths then you don't know Islam.

And as far as that goes, what a person does in the name of religion is NOT necessarily the same as what the religion espouses.

There is no such thing as Moderate/Radical Islam. Fuck the "Media" no matter the topic.

IGotNext
2016-10-03, 01:43 PM
Here's a NEG I received from a presumptuous moron named DNPactivist

"https://islamqa.info/en/214074 don't believe omega, I suggest you start reading about sexual slavery too on IslamQA, even omega doesn't deny the things said on IslamQA, it is not an anti-islamic site like religionofpeace.com so yeah"
Omega is my source of knowledge about Islam?

What makes you think I am "believing Omega?" I don't know him and we have had exactly ZERO conversations reference Islam. He has nothing to do with what I know about Islam. He doesn't even know what I think about Islam. LOL, you idiot.

No clue what you're talking about, son. You have no fucking idea what my position is on Islam whatsoever. Cool though that you won't let that stop you from making presumptions based on what I said earlier and in so doing expose your lack of intellect.

Is it a habit for you to make yourself sound so stupid?

Omega
2016-10-03, 04:30 PM
Here's a NEG I received from a presumptuous moron named DNPactivist

"https://islamqa.info/en/214074 don't believe omega, I suggest you start reading about sexual slavery too on IslamQA, even omega doesn't deny the things said on IslamQA, it is not an anti-islamic site like religionofpeace.com so yeah"
Omega is my source of knowledge about Islam?

What makes you think I am "believing Omega?" I don't know him and we have had exactly ZERO conversations reference Islam. He has nothing to do with what I know about Islam. He doesn't even know what I think about Islam. LOL, you idiot.

No clue what you're talking about, son. You have no fucking idea what my position is on Islam whatsoever. Cool though that you won't let that stop you from making presumptions based on what I said earlier and in so doing expose your lack of intellect.

Is it a habit for you to make yourself sound so stupid?

Dnp marginally knows more about Islam than the average person here and he thinks that makes him an authority on the subject. That's why hes a coward and tries to undermine my posts in without posting here because he knows he would be made a fool of.

Lol at how he went on a tangent about something totally unrelated. We were just differentiating between a media buzz word and reality on the ground. Had nothing to do with Islam itself.

nihilixm
2016-10-03, 04:36 PM
Lol @ being religious in 2016 when the internet and science are a thing.

lol at getting non censored internet in the ME


tempted to neg for racism and ignorance.

you must be new here?

IGotNext
2016-10-03, 09:14 PM
Dnp marginally knows more about Islam than the average person here and he thinks that makes him an authority on the subject. That's why hes a coward and tries to undermine my posts in without posting here because he knows he would be made a fool of.

Lol at how he went on a tangent about something totally unrelated. We were just differentiating between a media buzz word and reality on the ground. Had nothing to do with Islam itself.

This.

But now I understand more about his motivation...

Omega
2016-10-03, 09:26 PM
lol at getting non censored internet in the ME

internet isnt censored lmao atleast not to the vast majority of people